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A dumb idea?

  
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A dumb idea?

 
DemerzelTarquin DemerzelTarquin
New User | Posts: 43 | Joined: 02/10
Posted: 11/19/13
11:45 AM

I have a 70 camino.

I have to commute every day for work, and want to make it into a decent mpg daily driver.

If I were to put a 96-00 4.3 vortec engine and running gear and wired it with the computer into it, would that work? Would I get the same mpg as some of the s10's? 20+ on the highway?

If so, what else would I need to do to convert the harness over to wire into the car with the ECM. I'm not worried about the power, as this would be a daily driver, that and some of the vortecs had a decent amount of power for that size of a vehicle.

What all would be involved and am I wasting time even thinking of this swap?

Thanks,
-Matt  

Dave632 Dave632
Addict | Posts: 2220 | Joined: 07/08
Posted: 11/19/13
01:22 PM

I don't see why it would not work if you install all the electronics from the original car. I was able to get over 20 mpg highway on my 95 Z28 and that had a high performance cam in it. The overdrive transmission is a big help in getting good performance along with good mileage.  
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wayne712222 wayne712222
User | Posts: 198 | Joined: 10/13
Posted: 11/19/13
03:46 PM

absolutely... it will work..

attempt to get the engine and transmission. harness and computer from a 96 or 97 model year.. so you don't end up fighting the PASSKEY system that came on some 98 and up models..

there have been a bunch of people who have done this...

you can easily pickup a revised fuel tank sending unit to mount the high pressure fuel pump in the tank ...

you will want to spend the time while the engine is out...

replace the engine oil pump and pickup screen.
replace the timing chain and sprockets. perhaps the plastic timing cover. they are cheep.  DON"T POUND THE DAMPER ON.. use the proper damper installation tool . pounding WILL RESULT in a broken crank..  guarantee it..  if you don't have an installer and cannot borrow one.. pick up a center bolt that's an inch to inch and a half longer to start pulling the damper in.. so you don't pull the threads out of the crank snout..

reseal the oil filter adaptor. and replace the pressure relief valve/s  gasket sets for this are easily available..

replace the head gaskets.. intake manifold gaskets. and the biggest investment.. replace the fuel injector spider.. with the later model that has electrical injectors at the end of each hose.. far superior design..

turns it into sequential fuel injection..

please... take the time to install the OBD2 port to talk to the computer and wire in a bulb for the check engine light..

the EGR valve is the most important thing to fuel economy on these..  if it pings on acceleration.. the EGR valve is probably blocked or stuck closed..  this will cause a LEAN condition on acceleration and it will PING.

you will need because the is an OBD2 engine.. the downstream oxygen sensor beyond the cat. and a cat. why...  high flow cats are available.. and the downstream oxygen sensor does the fine tuning. if you don't want to run any cat.. i know  trick to fool the downstream oxygen sensor into not going crazy with the air fuel ratio..


the TBI and Vortec engines use a fuel pump relay in parallel with the outer terminals of the 3 wire oil pressure switch..  this is easily duplicated . and the fuel pump fuse.. goes after these two devices and before the fuel pump..
the computer controls the relay.. to allow the fuel system to prime as you turn the key on.. the oil pressure comes up and closes the outer 2 contacts in the oil pressure sending unit to supply power to the fuel pump..  there is a way to use relays off the starter solenoid circuit to cause the fuel pump to turn on while cranking.. if you don't get the relay wired to the computer..

look for donors if you want an automatic.. in astro vans.. 2wd S10 pickups and 2 wheel drive blazers.. even full size pickups..

if your elcamino is a stick shift.. they did have these vortec engines as stick shift .. it takes a different computer and wiring harness.  



now.. before you dive into an engine swap to get better fuel economy...

what combo do you have in your elcamino now...???

what kind of carb..  what cam..  and the important thing..  how much manifold vacuum at idle.. and how much manifold vacuum at cruise speed..  and do you have headers or cast iron exhaust.. so an oxygen sensor bung could be installed .. this would allow you to use an air fuel ratio display/gauge to fine tune your carb..

what is your cruising RPM..  

swapping a cam.. fine tuning the idle transition feed restrictors.. again depending on which carb you have.. can get your far superior fuel economy...  i have a cam that i like to use for these ..

and there is the option.. of going to a smaller carb.. so you are operating it on the primary circuits at lower RPMs.. where its tuned.

try to include a carb number if you can..  so we can see which tuning aids are available easily..

gear ratio and rear tire size effect engine speeds at cruise.. going too low an RPM with a carb will hurt fuel economy.. as will spinning the motor too fast. this is where fuel injection comes into its own.. as its spraying fuel.. so it can operate at lower RPMs with MPG in mind..

list your info.. lets see if we can get you some fuel economy for less than a vortec swap..   and there are several vortec swap articles spread out in the magazines..  

DemerzelTarquin DemerzelTarquin
New User | Posts: 43 | Joined: 02/10
Posted: 11/25/13
10:09 AM

Sorry about the delay, I've been moving and internetless...


I have a 383 stroker with vortec heads, air gap intake, a comp cams .502/.510 cam (sm. duration) and a th350. Car has headers, carb is a 80507? (Holley 750 vac. sec. with elec. choke) I have a open 10 bolt rear with unknown gear ratio. I am unsure of the vacuum specs. I do however run about 2500 rpms cruising speed at roughly 60-65 mph o the highway.

I am basically looking for a daily driver that is reliable year round.


I do however have in my posession a built 200-4R and a 12 bolt with a 3.31 posi in it...Rear tire size is 235/65/15.  

Dave632 Dave632
Addict | Posts: 2220 | Joined: 07/08
Posted: 11/25/13
02:20 PM

I have a 4.3 V-6 in my 2001 S10 and it gets about 15 in town and 20-21 on the hwy. Its performance is OK but it will by no means match your 383. I think the rating is about 200hp which is at least 150 less than your present engine. Your Camino will be a real dog with one of those motors in it.
I would take Wayne's advice just go for tuning what you have or save the Camino and go buy one of the little 4 banger thingamajigs, (hopefully an American one), that are available today. It will cost you less with far fewer headaches.
Their performance is garbage but you cannot have both. You will have transportation and the Camino will be saved. I gave up trying to get both a long time ago. The 95 Z28 was the closest I came and compared to my fast cars it was a very distant cousin. It got about the same mileage as my S10 does now.  
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zman123 zman123
Enthusiast | Posts: 531 | Joined: 06/08
Posted: 11/27/13
07:58 AM

You might want to think about a cam change along with the OD transmission and gear change behind your 383. I get 22 MPG on the freeway in my 69 Malibu with a pretty built 357 and 700R4 with 3.73 gears. I put MSD Atomic fuel injection on it (check out my thread on the install) last year and it helped. Quite a bit less work than a complete transplant.  

Dave632 Dave632
Addict | Posts: 2220 | Joined: 07/08
Posted: 11/27/13
09:34 AM

Absolutely, +1  
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dond1965 dond1965
Enthusiast | Posts: 294 | Joined: 12/13
Posted: 12/04/13
06:10 PM

Icon QuoteDemerzelTarquin:
I have a 70 camino.

I have to commute every day for work, and want to make it into a decent mpg daily driver.

If I were to put a 96-00 4.3 vortec engine and running gear and wired it with the computer into it, would that work? Would I get the same mpg as some of the s10's? 20+ on the highway?

If so, what else would I need to do to convert the harness over to wire into the car with the ECM. I'm not worried about the power, as this would be a daily driver, that and some of the vortecs had a decent amount of power for that size of a vehicle.

What all would be involved and am I wasting time even thinking of this swap?

Thanks,
-Matt


some thing you might want to think about, if you use the 4.3 and th-200r4. wiring it up and using like gm did is all good, but if you want economy, an idea for you.... if you can afford a gear vendors unit, [which is marketed as an over/under drive] you can use it behind the trans in the UNDERDRIVE mode, coupled with 3.08 gears, you can get some pep out of this set up! drive around in underdrive most of the time, shift into direct out on the highway, and now you have 3.08 gears plus the th-200 overdrive to lower rpms on the highway, but you can down shift the gear vendors for a close ratio passing gear! if i remember right you multiply 1.28 times the ring and pinion with the underdrive, so that would give you a 3.94 final in underdrive. with the 3.08 gears, and the th-200 overdrive [0.67 i think] and the gear vendors in direct, your high way gearing is 2.06 to one!!... good luck with whatever you do bro